You could argue that they are irresponsible young kids.
Far from it these are just little yobos.
There are bigger yobos and great big hairy - probably with a paunch - yobos.
I reckon that for the most part once a yobo always one. They grow up and have little yobo children who are uncared for and undisciplined. They will sit at their tele and drink beer while the kids are out creating havoc. These kids learn to take care of themselves by grouping with other yobos.
Some of the parents have in the past visited this blog and been permitted to make comments. Then when they are banned they eventually give up.
Many are to be found on the Nowhere chat group. Go there and you'll be educated into the kind of yobs we have in amongst us.
I visited them when they posted the thread "Dellow is a cunt" which still appears on some graffiti in town if you know where to look. They seemed surprised when I turned up as a poster on the thread and since then having ignored them, they ignore me!
Comments will still appear along the lines "I saw Dellow on the curb in town and only just resisted running him over."
For the most part the yobos here haven't a clue who I am but because their mates are having a dig they join in - Good for a laugh!
Whilst initially ignoring them, I'm changing my mind and feel that we have to go in and sort them out and make them more aware of what its like to be human and considerate of others.
These are the kind of people that are supporting the BNP and aggressive to any group that doesn't agree with them.
If our society is not to go totally downhill we have to deal with these kind of people and not ignore them.
How?
44 comments:
Keith, I find your use of the C word extremely offensive, especially when the younger generation are inclined to read your blog re:- pottery etc.
I am sorry, but they have won and lowered you to their level,Keyboard Warrior !
I suggest that you start to live in the real world.
It's Geoff BTW
There are NO, and never have been, any supporters of the BNP,or their ilk on the Knowhere Board.
We are a decent (?) bunch of Ulverston people having a bit of banter and a laugh, wherever possible, in a world where we are surrounded by opinionated, egotistical, fascist do gooders, dedicated to denying us the right to free speech, so painfully gained by the lads and lasses who sacrificed so much during WW2.
Rightly or wrongly, we all have an opinion, at least on our board you can express said opinion, and be villified or praised for it, but at least we will not be self righteously moderated.
There are, indeed, some masters of wordsmithery in our midst, and rather you were lowered to our level, I would suggest you wpuld really struggle to elevate yourself to ours!!!
Take a look at knowhere.
It speaks for itself.
Let's call it racist against anyone different to themselves.
Promoting violence to those they know nothing about.
They could well be the same people that do mindless graffiti. Not a group to be ignored in my opinion.
shut the fuck up will you to daft prick
Take your head out of your own arse for a second and you would realise Knowhere was a welcoming and tolerant forum. Any references to violence are a "joke" - you might want to look it up. That's right, you probably aren't going to be intentionally run over any time soon.
And are you seriously suggesting that a bunch of middle aged (some retired) men are responsible for the town's graffiti? They 'could' be the same people responsible. Equally, you 'could' be responsible for 9/11.
To coin a phrase, you're off your fucking rocker, Keith, and your fantastical opinions don't count for half as much as you would like to believe.
Two points Geoff. Firstly ,none of the photos in your original post appear to have been taken in Ulverston so what are you driving at ?
Secondly ,the Knowhere board is a beer-blog ,it's a laugh ,nothing more nothing less. I look at it now and then ,it appears to be full of middle-aged blokes and the odd female.
You are ,not for the first time ,making a problem where tnere isn't one.
This group reminds me of the bullies at school with the defence -
"It was only a joke sir"
Some people don't seem to learn to empathise with others different to themselves.
When they get together as a group they are self supporting and unable to see themselves as others do.
It isn't healthy to our divisive society to encourage groups like this to continue without making contact so they can see what reality actually looks like.
This group use pseudonyms and hide were they meet.
It would be great if we could actually go in a chat to them instead of being sniped at from hidden places.
"It's a beer-blog - it's a laugh" is no consolation to the recipient.
Why can't they come out in the open, look you in the eyes and talk straight to your face?
One Ralph Spours, another of their occasional targets, with all his faults, is worth far more to Ulverston society than the lot of them.
I agree with you Geoff, this knowhere ulverston group are becoming too strong. They target notable locals such as yourself. They meet daily in the town pubs and discuss targets and tactics. They are a local Ku-lux group. Their Captains are Wise Old Dave and Zap, both have long histories of violence and criminal damage. The town would appreciate you curbing their activities.
DM
DM,
It's not me that will change things it's us.
We let them get away with this without speaking up.
We need ourselves to speak out clearly and not hide behind anonymity as they do.
Good to get your support and not make excuses like A.R.
We could even enter their little club as I have done and take them on as ourselves.
One person on their own will achieve nothing. Officials like the police do not speak so effectively as we the public.
think i could name a couple of em
chainsaw = nick tate ,manager of canal head petrol, lives oubas hill
Zap = steve sherdley ,son of local policeman, ex glaxo worker, lives on fountain st, alleged friend of ralph spours
ilikeeatingthings = tom henderson, lives church walk, son of local teacher also ulverstonrant
hope it helps
Rings true to me!
Any more offers?
I can't believe how gullible you are to fall for DM's posting and to thank him for his support ! IT'S A WIND-UP ! AR had it right ,the nowhere board is just a beer blog. And I knew you would have to flag up Spours ,the arch self-publicist. At least Ralph is sociable and like to get in the pubs and bars and meet real people . And if you can't take a bit of stick don't keep putting your head above the parapet.I repeat ,there is nothing sinister about the nowhere board.
I'm pretty sure DM was being sarcastic. You really are making a fool of yourself with this one, Geoff. Like AR said, you're making a problem where there isn't one.
It's only bullying if it's malicious and directed at someone - as you admitted yourself, this group were completely ignoring you until you decided to attack them. Or are you saying that ignoring you is also a form of bullying? Absolutely pathetic.
If you guys could stop hiding behind your anonymous postings, then we could start to talk for real.
As it is communication is almost pointless.
As for DM's posting I agree that it was probably a wind-up but how do you tell.
The "notable local" bit didn't ring true!
As for my having opinions that is what this blog tries to do in order to promote discussion of a rational nature.
It's also interesting that the graffiti referred to echos some of the things said on the nowhere chat group.
Where do you think they get their ideas from?
Ok Keith we can arrange a meeting with you in one of the local pubs,beers are on you tho.Pick a pub and a time and we can all meet in there and talk
a few more of that lot:
early doors = eric twinge, lives on or near acacia road
blueherring = pete parker, lives forest hills area
hamsterhater = diana prince, don't know address
Sounds good to me, though I won't be buying any drinks.
"Churchwarden" is none other than Steve Rogers.
Funny isn't it? Nobody's been commenting on your board for yonks. Subjects of complete disinterest to eveybody, so you must have been getting sick to the back teeth of being ignored, as your immense ego could not stand that...so ....what do you do? Attack the lads and lasses on the knowhere board(lightbulb goes off in skull!) knowing full well that being an animated bunch we would not let that go unnoticed....clever....very clever!!
Thanks Nigel,
Good to another 'real person'
And who'se Steve Rogers ?
He is a fitter at Glaxo. Quite often drinks in the Glaxo Club with Bruce Banner & co.
The need to use foul language is hardly surprising — plenty of it on the TV. Hearing it there somehow makes it acceptable. It merely shows a lack of good vocabulary. I once had a head teacher who swore in just about every sentence he uttered. (Sad, the children would have been punished if they did the same.) He was also a bully and the children were scared of him. I had absolutely no respect for him as a head, a teacher, or as a decent human being.
Personally, I would not visit sites which I found offensive. (I accidently visited one and saw the way a young man spoke about his girl friend — cowardly cruel. I would not take anything that site offered seriously. Just a lot of hot air and gas)
It seems to me, Geoff, that you are giving the opposition bricks to throw at you. Shame as you have much to offer the youth of this place.
As to Ralph Spours, a true gentleman and I love the way he dresses for every occasion. If I want to know what is happening in Ulverston, I visit his site.
This will be anonymous, otherwise I might well find myself in your situation. But you do good work and there are many Ulverstonians who appreciate your efforts.
Beer Blog? Recognition should also be given to campaigns run to improve the culinary standard of food on offer in our quirky little Market Town.
There has been many a serious and professional critique undertaken around the standard fayre on offer vis a vis meat 'n taty pies.
After several heated, but well orchestrated campaigns some Bakers have now not only included meat, but have indeed increased the %meat to taty ratio. The Knowhere Board is an irreplaceable public service and long may they continue....Hurrah!!
Sadly, they are an intimidating lot that need soft targets for their bullying humour.
Their threats of violence are clearly off-putting especially when one is aware of the alcohol fueled behaviour that is possible from a group of people thinking irrationally.
Why am I getting involved when the motto "let sleeping dogs lie" is a wise one?
My concern was prompted by the news of increased mindless behaviour across the country. I believe that because of its size Ulverston has an unusual opportunity to curb the decline in behaviour in the town.
Taking on groups that demonstrate this is important. (And they're not confined to Knowhere by any means).
The general public is often loosing the confidence to confront bad behaviour that is seen in our streets yet , speak out we must or in ten years time we'll experience some dire consequences.
As always, you missed the point and the moment!
I can reveal other names if you would like to be outed?
WOD = ???, lives at ???
I note that Steve S has suddenly adopted a low profile.
I suggest you refrain from abusing and bullying Geoff D .
Geoff, some advice, publish this and my last post. Leave it on line 3 - 4 days and the then delete the complete thread, let it end.
I bet they all drink in the roxy
My thoughts are 'right idea, wrong target'. These are not the anti-social element who are the problem. You'll find them rolling out of the Sun at 2am.
Are you suggesting that people who call others, they don't even know, 'a cunt', aren't anti-social?
Strange morality when someone who then calls the foul mouthed people 'Yobos' has got it wrong.
Their behaviour , I suggest, sets the tone for other Yobos in the town to follow. I'd be surprised if younger people didn't read the knowhere chat room - which is perhaps where the idea for several cases of graffiti come from.
As for the 'guns blazing' remark - you ain't seen nothing yet! When I focus on something I really pull the stops out. How else do you think I converted the Oxfam building and ran it from 9am till 10 pm in 1986 ?
At the moment I'm recovering from an illness and have a major project on elsewhere!
Definition "Anti-social":
1. Shunning the society of others; not sociable.
- One bloke complaining about a group of many who are happily and innocuously interacting with each other. Who's anti-social again?
2. Antagonistic toward or disrespectful of others; rude.
- Who was the antagonist here? One group was actually ignoring the other before, completely out of the blue, being accused of being yobos, graffiti artists and beer swilling thugs. If that's not rude I don't know what is.
Are you suggesting you're not anti-social Geoff? Maybe you could ask Tom Bowden at Working Class Heroes for his opinion on who is rude and disrespectful?
Want another definition?
3. Hostile to or disruptive of the established social order.
Disrupting the estabished order? Sound familiar? You're about as anti-social as it's possible to be.
You make up you're own scenarios to prove your point!
As you weren't with Tom and I at Workingclass Heroes - the shop was empty - you're just making it up!
A made-up scenario? One of us must be barking mad, because I distinctly remember Tom himself recounting what had happened and his feelings of outrage on the matter.
On the subject of "making up scenarios to prove a point", I refer you back to accusing Knowhere posters of being yobs, graffiti artists and even BNP supporters! Given you don't even know who they are - and have even been soliciting their names on here to try and get some idea - you're not only deluded, you're also being grossly hyprocritical.
Geoff,
Whilst I agree that many of the jibes at you on the knowhere board are cruel, you must respect its users' right to free speech. In fact, this kind of ribald, crude or scatalogical humour simply reflects the working class culture in which we live. I am not trying to justify rudeness, or say that I would behave like that myself; I merely suggest that you should be able to contextualize humour, and not confuse it with any attempt to foment hatred or sedition.
There is a wider problem of free speech being curtailed in the UK, epitomised by the home secretary Jaqui Smith banning US radio talk show host Michael Savage from entering the UK in May 2009.
On the radio, Savage has described the UK as being "one ginourmous skid row" and "full of drunken sluts in the gutter". Whilst I disagree with the majority of Savage's views, I fully respect his freedom to express them.
Those who seek to silence the views of others undermine the potential for genuinely constructive dialectic and debate.
Reading this blog Geoff i honestly think you've picked the wrong guys to have a go at.These guys post on knowhere and have a laugh at things,then all of a sudden you attack them via your blog.Now there bound to come on here and stick up for themselves,i think it will get a lot worst now for you tho.All you had to do was keep quite go about your own business and let them get on with it but no you attacked them and now look whats happening.
You think you can change ulverston for the better,but not everyone agrees with you and then you pick and choose whats posted on the blog,if you don't agree with them then there posts aren't published on the blog.Take tesco's a lot of people wanted them in town,i spoke to many people regarding tesco and they all wanted it yet you claim more didn't want to see tesco in town.Your just like the other idiot spours he fought and cried over focus coming to town yet a vote was made and most wanted focus in town yet we never got it.One of the main reason's he didn't want it is because there was also plans for an estate agent to open next door,now he objected to that cause he didn't want anyone treading on his patch.So basically he wasn't thinking of the town he was thinking of himself.That just shows what the town think of him,he doesn't care what the town wants long as he comes out of it ok,just look what happen a few years ago when he was in charge of the raffle,it was won by his mate chattaway in the farmers,where doe's spours spend most of his time?yeah thats right drinking in the farmers with chattatwat
Sloane, a well thought out and well crafted riposte, if I may make so bold.
However....the working class comment was uncalled for in my opinion. Humour is not dictated by class, education, or even ethnicity, I would suggest. It is a uniquely individual characteristic that would be impossible to bracket or pigeonhole....
Your wordsmithery does you credit though!
Re Tom Bowden.
My version is considerably different but then why would you believe me!
I have always been very supportive of all that Tom has been doing and continue to be so. My attitude does not change.
Looking at some older stuff on my web site at http://www.myulverston.co.uk/skate/tom/index.html
will give you an idea.
This particular time I went in to have a supportive chat as to how the skate park was going - it having just been put in place.My postings at the time were to encourage people from the neighbourhood to go and chat to these young people. They are people I admire and have always supported in a number of ways.
I waited as I always do until Tom was not busy.
What was the stumbling block in our conversation was that Tom proceeded to go onto the computer while we were talking. I waited, politely, for him to finish but as he felt that he could not give me his full attention I stopped talking.
I always do this whoever I talk to. If others can't give me eye contact as I talk to them I stop - in mid sentence sometimes.
There was no rudeness on my part.
As Tom was unwilling to talk to me in any other way I left quietly and went elsewhere - there were no harsh words. I am just unwilling to continue a conversation with anyone who is unwilling to give me their full attention when I have waited for it. I have no problem waiting as long as it takes.
Yet after you left tom you ran straight home and posted about it on your blog,things like this should be kept between you both but no you thought you had to post about it.So now people would read that and think of tom in a different light.At the end of the day he runs a shop,not that i've used it but seem's very successful and i don't think thats the kind of place to discuss things.Why couldn't you email him or even ask him if there's a good time to talk to him instead of just turning up and expecting him to drop everything to talk to you
As you say, it's all a matter of opinion. You've had your say, just like Tom had his:
"With regards to your visit to my shop, you rather rudely demanded my full attention as if I am somehow accountable to you. I am more then happy to talk but sometimes, when at work, my full attention is not always possible. You say "refused to discuss" the issue with you. I did not refuse, but when I questioned your rudeness you walked out of my shop."
As far as I know, Tom doesn't post on Knowhere, so when he classed you as rude, it was an independent, unbiased assessment.
Whatever the rights and wrongs, I don't think this discussion can really go anywhere, so (unless there is more "sorting out" to be done) we should probably just agree to disagree, leave it alone and be on our merry ways.
To
"Yet after you left tom"
I suggest anyone interested reads my comments in context at
http://geoffdellow.blogspot.com/2009/05/get-yourself-down-to-lightburn-park.html
I've spoken to two of knowhere's most active writers this eve and we've all found this scenario completely ridiculous! It is really quite unbelievable how this has become such an enormous issue.....mountain out of a molehill springs to mind! Geoff, you clearly have an awful lot of time to dwell on things. Yes, you've been the subject of some rather lighthearted banter on here but that is it.....never have any of these people been a threat to your life, love, happiness or indeed pottery. It has been blown out of all proportion and the whole thing has now become quite laughable. If you were attempting to gain some sympathy and respect out of this I'm afraid to say that it's all gone too far. It's beyond the point of no return. Just let it go. None of the people on here are going to attack you physically in any way shape or form. Yes, we may attack you verbally but sadly, as you chose to go into politics this should be expected. Just go about your business and let us go about ours and hopefully we can all live in peace.
I agree this issue is a molehill as far as Ulverston's social scene is concerned.
The comments here have illustrated the kind of people that are on this group and this I believe is helpful to the community at large.
It is apparent that some people are intimidated by their attitude and feel the need to post anonymously.
I hope that in the future this group can resist the jibes at individual people that they know little about in what is a public forum and one I suspect accessed by younger people.
Even now one member is overstepping the line of decency towards someone they clearly don't know.
There is perhaps a need to review whether anonymous comments are published here in the future.
Mature people need to be helped to use the internet in a way consistent with the way they relate to people face to face. The use of pseudonyms in a place like Ulverston seems to me to be totally unnecessary and leads to apprehension because one has no idea who one is dealing with.
Those like Tom Henderson that have the privileged of talking sense to this group are at an advantage over the rest of us and I hope he will exercise this.
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